This post is for those who study Bible scripture and is not designed for converting or preaching. The topic is Government and how it relates to the Bible.

Where do governmental leaders come from?

Romans 13:1
13 Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God.


Can we get evil leaders who intentionally do harm?

1 Samuel 8:6-7
But the thing displeased Samuel when they said, “Give us a king to judge us.” And Samuel prayed to the Lord. And the Lord said to Samuel, “Obey the voice of the people in all that they say to you, for they have not rejected you, but they have rejected me from being king over them.

1 Samuel 8:10-18
10 So Samuel told all the words of the Lord to the people who were asking for a king from him. 11 He said, “These will be the ways of the king who will reign over you: he will take your sons and appoint them to his chariots and to be his horsemen and to run before his chariots. 12 And he will appoint for himself commanders of thousands and commanders of fifties, and some to plow his ground and to reap his harvest, and to make his implements of war and the equipment of his chariots. 13 He will take your daughters to be perfumers and cooks and bakers. 14 He will take the best of your fields and vineyards and olive orchards and give them to his servants. 15 He will take the tenth of your grain and of your vineyards and give it to his officers and to his servants. 16 He will take your male servants and female servants and the best of your young men1 and your donkeys, and put them to his work. 17 He will take the tenth of your flocks, and you shall be his slaves. 18 And in that day you will cry out because of your king, whom you have chosen for yourselves, but the Lord will not answer you in that day.”

1 Samuel 8:19-22
19 But the people refused to obey the voice of Samuel. And they said, “No! But there shall be a king over us, 20 that we also may be like all the nations, and that our king may judge us and go out before us and fight our battles.” 21 And when Samuel had heard all the words of the people, he repeated them in the ears of the Lord. 22 And the Lord said to Samuel, “Obey their voice and make them a king.” Samuel then said to the men of Israel, “Go every man to his city.”


Should we listen to or obey governmental leaders?

Romans 13:2-5
2 Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, 4 for he is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God’s wrath on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God’s wrath but also for the sake of conscience.


Should we pay taxes?

Romans 13:6
6 For because of this you also pay taxes, for the authorities are ministers of God, attending to this very thing.


Should we kill bad leaders?

1 Samuel 26:9-11
9 But David said to Abishai, “Don’t destroy him! Who can lay a hand on the Lord’s anointed and be guiltless? 10 As surely as the Lord lives,” he said, “the Lord himself will strike him, or his time will come and he will die, or he will go into battle and perish. 11 But the Lord forbid that I should lay a hand on the Lord’s anointed….


Can you disobey leaders?

Daniel 6:4-5,7,10,16,22,24
4 Then the presidents and princes sought to find occasion against Daniel concerning the kingdom; but they could find none occasion nor fault; forasmuch as he was faithful, neither was there any error or fault found in him. 5 Then said these men, We shall not find any occasion against this Daniel, except we find it against him concerning the law of his God.

7 All the high officials of the kingdom, the prefects and the satraps, the counselors and the governors are agreed that the king should establish an ordinance and enforce an injunction, that whoever makes petition to any god or man for thirty days, except to you, O king, shall be cast into the den of lions.

10 Now when Daniel knew that the writing was signed, he went into his house; and his windows being open in his chamber toward Jerusalem, he kneeled upon his knees three times a day, and prayed, and gave thanks before his God, as he did aforetime.

16 Then the king commanded, and they brought Daniel, and cast him into the den of lions. Now the king spake and said unto Daniel, Thy God whom thou servest continually, he will deliver thee.

22 My God hath sent his angel, and hath shut the lions’ mouths, that they have not hurt me: forasmuch as before him innocency was found in me; and also before thee, O king, have I done no hurt.

24 And the king commanded, and they brought those men which had accused Daniel, and they cast them into the den of lions, them, their children, and their wives; and the lions had the mastery of them, and brake all their bones in pieces or ever they came at the bottom of the den.


Was Hitler put in place by God?

The answer is no. I thought I should address this since it comes up a lot in these types of discussion.

Hitler was not elected. He was not placed in power, FACT: Hitler lost the presidential election of 1932, Paul von Hindenburg was re-elected to a second seven-year term of office. Paul von Hindenburg was placed in power per.

A party of people within the citizenship started complaining, sabotaging, disobeying, etc, much like we see here in the states. They rebelled against those God has chosen. They then moved to the last phase to force changes, kill opposition and dismantle the governing body.

In February 1933, Hitler blamed a devastating Reichstag fire (most likely murdered) on the communists and convinced President Hindenburg to sign a decree suspending individual and civil liberties (by force), a decree Hitler used to silence his political enemies with false arrests (by force). Upon the death of Hindenburg in 1934 (more murders), Hitler proceeded to purge the Brown Shirts (by force), the head of which, Ernst Roem, had begun voicing opposition to the Nazi Party’s terror tactics. Hitler had Roem executed without trial (murdered), which encouraged the army and other reactionary forces within the country to urge Hitler to further consolidate his power by merging the presidency and the chancellorship (Removed governmental authority). This would make Hitler the commander of the army as well (by force). A plebiscite vote was held on August 19. Intimidation (fear of death) made him a full powered dictator. After this, he continued the use of force and murder.


Was leadership in America put in place by God?

The answer is yes. America was a new country with a new leadership structure and thus meets the criteria.

The colonies in America were founded by companies and backed by countries using military force. They were not securely held by any one country so there was no leadership in place over it. They were fought over for control by both local and foreign powers (including British authority). Consolidation of the colonies lead to a war between local allies and foreign powers. A new nation was formed that then was appointed a leader.

A number of English colonies were established under a system of Proprietary Governors, who were appointed under mercantile charters to English joint stock companies to found and run settlements.

Examples:

Between 1584 and 1589, the English attempt to establish Roanoke Colony failed, and in 1590 the colony was found abandoned.

In 1607, Jamestown, Virginia was founded by the London Company (also known as the Virginia Company).

In Newfoundland, a chartered company known as the Society of Merchant Venturers established a permanent settlement at Cuper’s Cove, from 1610.

St. George’s, Bermuda was founded by the Virginia Company, in 1612.

I would also note that when the leaders were disputed by force in the US it lead to a civil war. As I stated with Hitler, the people suffered and there was a loss of life. This is what happens each time people try to reject those put in place by God, but keep in mind those are the leaders requested by the people.

Join the conversation! 13 Comments

  1. I read this post the other day and thought about it. Then it occurred to me, this is what makes America different from the rest of the world and I wonder if the founding fathers took these principles and incorporated them into the Bill of Rights and the U.S. Constitution. In the U.S the power is to the people, the people regulate and control the government, well at least that was the plan. So, this may be a stretch or it could be right on point. If the U.S. government is for and by the people, then the government must abide by what we set forth, not us abiding by them.

    Liked by 2 people

    Reply
    • I would say you are right based on a few points.

      1) The people out number members of government so they must at some point conform to the will of the people (this is why division is needed)

      2) If you are biblical then you know through scripture that God gives the people what they ask for or desire. Why then should government deny what was given by God.

      3) Simply put, if you run on a platform and the people elect you for it… why not follow it? Good or Bad, right or wrong, do what you were elected to do.

      Liked by 1 person

      Reply
  2. So the devastation inflicted on indigenous people worldwide through colonialism? They certainly did it in the name of god. Everywhere they planted their flag misery followed. They were simply following the supported leadership of their country whose rules allowed discovery and theft in the name of Jesus.

    Liked by 1 person

    Reply
    • You Stated — “So the devastation inflicted on indigenous people worldwide through colonialism? ”

      My Response — From a bible perspective they were warned not to use human leaders but ignored the warning and got what they wanted. The entire article is about, “the people”, choosing their own leaders and rejecting God. I hear what you are saying but that’s not what this article said.

      1 Samuel 8:10-18
      10 So Samuel told all the words of the Lord to the people who were asking for a king from him. 11 He said, “These will be the ways of the king who will reign over you: he will take your sons and appoint them to his chariots and to be his horsemen and to run before his chariots. 12 And he will appoint for himself commanders of thousands and commanders of fifties, and some to plow his ground and to reap his harvest, and to make his implements of war and the equipment of his chariots. 13 He will take your daughters to be perfumers and cooks and bakers. 14 He will take the best of your fields and vineyards and olive orchards and give them to his servants. 15 He will take the tenth of your grain and of your vineyards and give it to his officers and to his servants. 16 He will take your male servants and female servants and the best of your young men1 and your donkeys, and put them to his work. 17 He will take the tenth of your flocks, and you shall be his slaves. 18 And in that day you will cry out because of your king, whom you have chosen for yourselves, but the Lord will not answer you in that day.”

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      Reply
      • Without leaders there is no god to lead. The prophets inflicted plenty of deceit and misery upon their neighbors, even breaking treaties (priest of Baal). The fact is god does not exist but in the mind. If you could be led by god and not men, how would that work when god has never been present but in the tools of a few lunatics? Who gets to decide “the god” and what his will is? What is the will of god?

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        • You Stated — “The prophets inflicted plenty of deceit and misery upon their neighbors, even breaking treaties (priest of Baal). ”

          My Response — I understand that humans do these things but I’m not sure how it connects to god.

          Are you saying that if we remove religion from the world that these things, (deceit and misery), will not exist?

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          • You didn’t answer the question. How would you put this together to have god as the government?

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            Reply
            • You State — “You didn’t answer the question. How would you put this together to have god as the government?”

              My Response — I was answering the question when my wife forced me to go get my hair cut so I replied with what I could at the time.

              The answer to your question is, “I have no idea”, it’s a biblical mystery. I would imagine it goes a bit like Nineveh but on a global scale with a transfer of power to god. It may require everyone on earth accepting god to trigger it.

              Like I said it wasn’t a post on conversion but rather a biblical study post on what the bible has to say about leaders.

              Hope that provides some clarity

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              • global scale with a transfer of power to god”. You do realize how ridiculous this is?

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                • If you are atheist what would not be considered ridiculous that’s related to religion and politics?

                  I think the obvious issue is that politics are so bad that people run to religion for solutions.

                  Liked by 1 person

                  Reply
                  • When I deconverted I remember a lot of the same sentiments. I had lived a very independent life, established many of my own ideas and moved a bit around the world, always calling my own shots with careers, business ventures, exploring the world and spending years of my life outside of the system—except religion. It gave me a serious pause.
                    They things you are saying and also the things you’re avoiding are exactly what the programming does. Now you act as though religion and the outcomes of religion are somehow separate. Politics and religion are two entities that think they are using each other for the greater good. Bedfellows of errancy. You have a lot of great observations about a lot of things, but are still a slave to your anchoring biases. After unbelief it becomes all to clear this game that has been played masterfully upon the foibles of human nature and psychology.

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                    Reply
                    • You Stated — “They things you are saying and also the things you’re avoiding are exactly what the programming does.”

                      My Response — I’m intrigued by what you believe I’m avoiding, elaborate.

                      You Stated — “Now you act as though religion and the outcomes of religion are somehow separate.”

                      My Response — I would say it is impossible to separate religion from an outcome of itself to the environment or people subscribed to it. You can’t easily avoid cause and effect.

                      I think you are conflating my perspective of (deceit and misery) within mankind and its existence within religious practices.

                      Here is what I think:
                      Religion can cause deceit and misery
                      Deceit and misery exist in the absence of religion
                      People cause deceit and misery
                      People sometime use religion to cause deceit and misery
                      People sometime use politics to cause deceit and misery
                      People sometime use culture to cause deceit and misery
                      People sometime use education to cause deceit and misery
                      People sometime use race to cause deceit and misery
                      People sometime use science to cause deceit and misery

                      The true cause of deceit and misery is people not the things they use to deploy it. Eliminating a deployment method will not eliminate deceit and misery.

                      You Stated — “Politics and religion are two entities that think they are using each other for the greater good.”

                      My Response — Politics and religion, by design, are not made for the greater good. They are literally defined as compromise and/or division. I’m not sure how you came to a “Greater Good” conclusion.

                      Bible Perspective:
                      Luke 12:51-53 King James Version (KJV)
                      51 Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:
                      52 For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three.
                      53 The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

                      Political Perspective:
                      Partisan animosity has increased substantially over time. In each party, the share with a highly negative view of the opposing party has more than doubled since 1994. Most of these intense partisans believe the opposing party’s policies “are so misguided that they threaten the nation’s well-being.”. Republicans and Democrats are more divided along ideological lines – and partisan antipathy is deeper and more extensive – than at any point in the last two decades.

                      Liked by 1 person

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Knowledge Is Power

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